|
Post by Janine 1984 on Dec 10, 2013 18:03:30 GMT
So glad we are back up and running! The past few weeks I have come to think of something that a lot of us have mentioned in previous threads. That is- once we escaped an abuser, how come often we find ourselves falling for another controlling man? In my case I did date one more really not healthy man after I left the abusive one and ever since I try so hard to detect early signs, to stay away from anyone who gives me a bad vibe and to focus on feeling stronger and to not settle for less than a very good man. This brings me to a question I have regarding warning signs. One thing to look out for is to see how a man talks about his ex and how their relationship is and if he seems too good to be true, he probably is. Now i have met a man a while ago and went on a date and he talked nicely about his ex and remained friends with her BUT there was one situation when my alarm bells went off. He had a few drinks and opened up more and then talked about his brother's ex wife. We were at a bar and it was quite crowded so we kept the conversation the entire time before that at a decent noise level to not disturb other guests. When he talked about the divorce his brother went through and how much money his brother had to give his ex wife etc. he suddenly changed- he got louder and he called his ex sister in law "bitch" a lot of times. More than " he should need to" ...besides the fact it's never nice to call anyone a bitch. Especially not if she is the mother of your niece and nephew. Now I wonder if I overreacted and read too much into this. Since I have moved for my job since and wont ever see this man again he wont be a threat to me should he have abusive tendencies-- but in general I am asking myself how good is my radar? I guess what needs to be learned is that we have to walk away from anything immediately that gives us a bad vibe. And to listen to what people say because they do give away a LOT by themselves I find without us noticing it and brushing it off as humor, sarcasm etc...when really it is right out the truth. This guy used to say to me the last time I talked to him: You will find a better man than me. I believe it
|
|
|
Post by HH Lindsey on Dec 10, 2013 23:07:13 GMT
And read the Jerk Radar by Steve so we know what to look out for and how to test and assess a potential partner early on in the relationship.
How they talk about their previous partner is an interesting one though. I do think 'bitch' is a bit off limits, but what if their previous partner really was not a very nice person? I mean, if someone were to chat to me about my exes, I would be less than complementary about the first one (abusive, bad father, just interested in his ego and appearance, etc) whereas I would be quite different about my actually-only-separated ex, because he was a nice person but alcoholic, which he just cannot shake off. So if someone were listening to me speaking about two different men, they could easily get the impression that it would be better to stay away from me, because my 'hostility' towards ex1 might be where my perception was wonky and therefore a warning sign. Or it might just be true.
In the case of the chappy you met, I think if your gut reaction was one of "be alert here", then I would trust that, rather than trying to reason out that maybe his ex had been fine, but his brother's was really a nightmare.
I solve the problem by not dating, anyone, at any time, even accidentally!
|
|
|
Post by theresa on Dec 26, 2013 5:13:59 GMT
I do think that our gut reactions are better indicators sometimes than any specific statements or at times even behaviour. If it makes you go "hmm," then it's probably not right for you.
Recently, I cancelled on a date with a man I had not yet even been out with. I was ill, and my dog had just died, and I didn't need to explain myself to anyone. Afterwards, he asked me if I was really sick or?. My gut said... this is bad news, but I gave it another shot. You can't judge people on one bad moment, right?
Or maybe you can. Then, he took exception to two things I said, neither of which were anything more than commonplace comments. First, I commented that it was probably a bit scary for his sister, who had just finished cancer treatment, to go to her doctor's appt. that day. Well... excuse me! Then, he apologized and said he was being defensive because he read my comment as a statement that his sister was doomed. Huh? When he apologized, I said he was introspective to be able to see that. And then all hell broke loose. He was really angry and "did not like that." Since when is introspective an insult? Then, my gut said... DONE, and I told him never to contact me again.
It felt so good to get rid of him. And Lindsey... I'm with you... not dating anyone at any time. I'm getting another couple of dogs.
Theresa
|
|
steve
Member
Admin
Posts: 266
|
Post by steve on Dec 28, 2013 4:39:05 GMT
Hey, Janine!
I don't think you overreacted at all. Trashing the ex is a big red flag, and I think it still applies to trashing someone else's ex, because it shows a willingness to blame her for everything that went wrong, and believing everything his brother told him. If you talked to my brother in law, he'd let you know what a terrible bitch his ex is, and if I believed him, I'd be very far wrong. He is the abusive partner, doing everything he can to humiliate and defeat his ex, even though they are three years separated, including harming the kids emotionally to get to her. But she's a bitch somehow. It's a bad sign always, and you should screen more carefully or ditch him. I also agree that over-complimenting the ex, as if she can do nothing wrong, especially if it is a covert way of saying what a great ex HE is, should be something to get interested about. I'd ask what her flaws were and how the relationship went south, what kind of things they used to disagree about and how they resolved them. If he gets uncomfortable, you'll know you're hitting close to home.
Above all, Theresa is right - trust your gut. If you're really lonely, a dog is seriously a great idea. They love to snuggle and don't every insult you and forgive everything and never blame you even when you are being mean. And they force you to exercise, too!
--- Steve
|
|
|
Post by Janine 1984 on Dec 28, 2013 21:51:05 GMT
Hey guys, thanks so much for the feedback....I am totally with you on the dog idea.
It's interesting how right ON both of you were. My gut instinct told me the moment he got drunk and really went on and on about his brother's ex wife in that bar in front of other people (which common sense tells me a normal man would NOT do that) Also, Steve, VERY interesting different point of view. I have come to believe that abusers ALWAYS bash their ex and this guy was talking about her as if she was a goddess (great career, he laughed at how she moved for him to a different country but then he left that country to follow HIS career dream and she decided to not follow him again and abandon her life) -- and it just all seemed..."off".... When he told me in a chat a while ago that " I would find a better man than him and I should believe him he wasnt that great of a guy" --- I took it for the truth and detached emotionally and now we have almost no contact anymore. Besides from one time over Christmas when he texted me that I must have been a "naughty B..." since I had a picture attached to my mass Christmas emails that was one of those funny/decoration Christmas pictures where you hold Hallmark cartons with for example Santa's beard and I had Santa's Nice/naughty scale in my hands. (funny fact- ALL of my friends and family just wrote back: "cute pic!" ....NONE commented in such a degrading way. HIGE warning sign for me.
He is OUT for good and I am glad I dodged yet another bullet. What Steve wrote rang some bells too. If this guy keeps his "ex" attached and plays her like a violin by giving her constant hope yet going out with other women and telling me his ex sends him 10 messages and lots of pictures each day....weird. Especially since he showed me pictures on his phone but made sure (I believe that was not a coincidence...) I would see that a LOT of the pictures in the same folder on his phone were of his ex. He probably is looking for a fanclub rather than seriously going out with someone with a brain. It is really a way to depict himself as a great ex. He would go on and on about how he gave his ex a car loan etc. and how he was thinking of buying apartments in this and that expensive city. Not attractive at all. currently looking at what breed I might like for a dog. It does make more sense. I am getting better and better at detecting abusers early on but I keep feeling as if I STILL attract them and/or ignore the GOOD men.
Again thanks a LOT for the feedback. Still learning...still baby steps away from falling for men that are so much like my childhood experiences with an abusive father and emotionally questionable mother who would abandon me and my brother quite a lot. Luckily there are good people out there and I have a wonderful aunt and friends who slowly teach me what love and healthy relationships are like.
|
|
|
Post by HH Lindsey on Dec 28, 2013 22:36:19 GMT
If your question regarding dog breeds was actually a question, I could wholeheartedly recommend the two we have. They are Maltese/Coton cross, brothers and about 8 years old. All the bichon dogs are bred as companion dogs, they don't need much walking but are quite happy about going for a walk, unless it is raining! They are intelligent and super cute and very good at picking up on emotions (if I'm upset or ill, they will come and cuddle up and lick me until I am feeling better), really good with children and can spot a nasty or abusive person quickly and accurately. Out two are also very communicative, eg pawing on doors to get in, have different growls or yelps for different meanings, etc. Both sleep on my bed at night too ... have had to invest in a second pillow for the other side of the bed, as one of them kept nicking mine. I have heard that poodles are also intelligent and good companion dogs. <<< Look There is one of them (Tickie) with my grand-daughter!
|
|
|
Post by theresa on Dec 29, 2013 5:47:19 GMT
Tickie is darling!! I am a cream Golden Retriever person all the way, gentle, biddable, stunningly beautiful. However, they weigh between 60 and 85 pounds generally. I like that your dogs are "talkers." That always makes me laugh. Abusers are generally not funny when they talk!
Steve, I also found the over praising of the ex an interesting warning sign. I would not have thought of that. Hmm.
I was oh so right on the lunatic I went out with. He emailed me today. The subject line was "Questions?" I had him blocked, but it came through on my smart phone anyway. I deleted it without reading it. Yes!!
Theresa
|
|
|
Post by Janine 1984 on Dec 29, 2013 15:21:20 GMT
Thanks guys, and having a dog has always felt right, I just need to ensure I move to an apartment with more nature around as I worked and lived in a city center for the past years in a small apartment. I do feel that (especially since he was very smart) anything could be used as a strategy to hook you. My gut was in this case faster at thinking that something was "off" and if his ex was such a great woman, why did they break up and why is she still sending him a lot of pictures of herself etc. He might have been a rather harmless more narcissistic type since he was "joking" when he said ' i use people until i get what i want" etc....but those arent jokes. There was always truth behind what my abusive ex was joking about and ever since I noticed how they use 'humor or sarcasm" to cover up our perception of how they act and talk. Its almost shocking how brutally honest abusers can be....
|
|
steve
Member
Admin
Posts: 266
|
Post by steve on Dec 29, 2013 16:49:29 GMT
I really do believe those "jokes" are tests to see what they can get away with. If someone says, "I'm really such a jerk sometimes," I'd believe him 100%!
The biggest thing to look for, I think, is the other person always trying to make out that they have no flaws or have never caused problems. Any black/white, goddess/bitch, all good vs. all bad kind of dichotomies are worth exploring more deeply. Narcissistic people tend to break the world into those that love me vs. those that hate me, which translates into those I exploit vs. those I punish.
Great point about dogs and abusers, too. Same with kids. Younger kids and dogs who have not been abused themselves generally have unencumbered jerk radar built in. If the kids or the dogs shy away or start growling at your date, it's time to dig deeper. They trust their instincts, which unfortunately many of us as adults have been trained to ignore.
---- Steve
|
|
|
Post by theresa on Dec 29, 2013 19:33:02 GMT
Maybe Steve, you have an idea for a new kind of therapy dog. There are those who warn of epileptic seizures, low-blood sugar etc... and now perhaps now for those of us who have been so abused we don't trust our own judgement... the jerk radar dog. Perhaps, I will name one of my new dogs Radar.
Abusers do tend to operate in extremes in most things. They generally have poor impulse control, they either worship you or loathe you, they present themselves as being totally wrong or completely "wronged," and they like to mix all that up just to confuse.
|
|
steve
Member
Admin
Posts: 266
|
Post by steve on Dec 30, 2013 18:48:10 GMT
I love it! "Jerk Sniffers," to go along with drug-sniffing dogs! Police could use them, too, when they get a DV call and both claim the other was the aggressor. "Sorry, Sir. Rolf here identifies you as the perpetrator. Please put your hands behind your back..."
---- Steve
|
|
|
Post by theresa on Dec 30, 2013 22:17:40 GMT
Love it Steve!
|
|